The Energy Imbued in Art
Topics:
“Images Versus Words”
“The Energy of the Creator of a Tarot Deck”
“Connecting to Pieces of Music and Artwork”
“AI as the Wave of the Future”
“Self-Awareness, Interconnectedness and Honor”
Friday, April 11, 2025 (Private/Phone)
Participants: Mary (Michael) and Jean-François (Samta)
ELIAS: Good afternoon!
JF: Good afternoon.
ELIAS: And how shall we proceed?
JF: Hey! (Laughs)
ELIAS: Spontaneously. (Chuckles)
JF: Here we are. (Elias chuckles) Yes. Well, let’s talk about the power of images.
ELIAS: Very well. What type of images?
JF: Well, the questions I’m about to ask could apply to different types of images, obviously tarot card images, but others also. Maybe I will have some specific examples.
ELIAS: Excellent.
JF: And the first question that I would ask is – last time we finished with this – how much more powerful are images compared to words, generally speaking? Like can some kind of measure be expressed? (Pause) We have this saying that an image is worth a thousand words, which already says something about it.
ELIAS: Yes. Images are more powerful and stronger than words, because words are limited to specific meanings whereas images are open to many different interpretations. And also, even if you are moving in a direction of specific interpretations, the interpretation itself is broader than it is with words because words are defined in specific meanings and therefore have boundaries.
JF: It’s much more delineated.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: And even if we arrive at a specific interpretation of an image, it comes from a larger pool of potential.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Yeah. Hence the interest in symbols and their aptitude at conveying a lot of different meanings.
ELIAS: Correct.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: And one image can mean different things to many different people, whereas one word means the same.
JF: Mm. It’s the same with dream and objective imagery. You know, what we see, what we encounter has different meanings—
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: — for different people, because it’s fundamentally abstract.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Yeah. And words are not abstract.
ELIAS: No.
JF: And then we can also get creative with words. Say as with poetry, and then it becomes closer to the quality of an image, right?
ELIAS: Yes. Because of the manner in which you put the words together.
JF: Yeah. It’s structured differently. It’s conveyed differently. It’s basically making images out of words.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: Which is what, I would say, good writers do, and especially in relation to fiction or fantasy. If they are putting words together in a manner that they can create images for the reader, and that the reader doesn’t have to work at conjuring the images that the writer is conveying, that is a sign of a good writer.
JF: Oh, that’s an interesting thing to say, because I don’t know that I would have said it that way. I might have considered things opened, more so opened to interpretation as more powerful in a way. But maybe that’s why I like tarot cards. (Laughs)
ELIAS: I would agree. And I would say that a writer is attempting to convey something in whatever direction they choose that is meant to bring ideas and images to the reader, to their audience. And just as their medium, for the most part, of words, they’re using those words in a configuration to convey to the audience, the reader, what they have in mind. Therefore like their medium, words, which are more structured and are more defined, less abstract, they’re using that medium to present specific images to their audience, with the exception of surrealists.
JF: Right. Right.
ELIAS: They are actually engaging almost the opposite of what most writers do. Which is why it’s difficult for many, many, many people to read what a surrealist has written, because for many people it will appear to not makes sense.
JF: But that would be good practice for a taro reader, actually, to read surrealist fiction. You know? Because in a way, I was listening to you and I’m like, oh well, when I read tarot, I’m kind of doing the job of the writer. I’m writing what the images are saying and relaying that to someone.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Or to myself. Yeah.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: We say tarot reader, but in a way we could say tarot writer.
ELIAS: You could.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: You very well could.
JF: Because that’s basically what we’re doing. We’re making words out of images.
ELIAS: Images.
JF: And then we, if we want to—
ELIAS: You’re doing the opposite of what the writer is doing, generally speaking, except for the surrealist writers.
JF: Yes. And then many times, with intuition there may be images coming in that are not in the cards and then I end up, you end up doing both.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Then you’re pulling the images as the writers are doing—
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: The fiction writers, and also making words out of them.
ELIAS: Correct.
JF: Yeah. Okay. Interesting. So if an image or a symbol is intended in a certain way at its creation say, but it is interpreted, understood in a different way by an individual – I mean, that happens all the time with a tool like tarot, for example. You know if we take any given deck with its imagery, the creators were, had something in mind say, but then it’s, of course, it’s open to interpretation. So my question is, when that happens, that difference between the intended meaning of a symbol and how it is interpreted subsequently, is there or can there be an affectingness upon the individual according to how the image was intended, and not necessarily how it is interpreted? It’s kind of like, almost like a subliminal effect kind of question.
ELIAS: Meaning that the individuals that created the deck had specific meanings for each card?
JF: Or a range. Yes. I mean, there will be a range of meaning associated with symbols. I mean the tarot tradition is built upon that.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: But my question, my curiosity—
ELIAS: But then if you’re interpreting it in relation to a particular individual, it may not be the same—
JF: Exactly. Yes.
ELIAS: — as what the creators intended.
JF: Yes. And that’s legitimate and it happens all the time.
ELIAS: Absolutely.
JF: But my curiosity is, in line with this idea that images are more powerful than words, and when people look at an image it has an impact, can that impact also come from how it was intended and not how it’s interpreted?
ELIAS: It’s a combination of both.
JF: It’s a combination.
ELIAS: Yes. Because there is a part of the interpretation and the cards that is based in how they were created. And that creates a piece that remains with them, even if the interpretation appears to be entirely different. There is still a piece of that original design, let us say, that is put forth in energy in the reading.
Now; let me say that in that, it may not be as black and white as it supposedly should appear. Therefore you could be engaging a writing with an individual and you may be interpreting the cards and you might be specifically addressing to each card individually initially and giving the interpretation of the card and giving that as expressed in relation to the individual’s energy. But somewhere in that reading, writing, there’s going to be pieces of the original creation of the cards and what they mean. There’s going to be that mixed into the entirety or the whole of the reading. It’s not necessarily going to be expressed with each card, but it will be somewhere in that reading.
JF: And therefore as an image, as images, this original meaning may have an impact upon the querent, even if it goes unrecognized.
ELIAS: Yes. And I would say that you’re going to be expressing some element of the creation of the cards because you’re identifying what they are: “This is a six of cups.” “This is a nine of wands.” Simply by saying that, you’re bringing that energy of the original creation into it.
JF: Yes. And then it also brings into play choose your deck wisely, because they all… They come from different energies and they, some of those decks I wouldn’t mess around with. (Both laugh) This also makes… I had another question. Maybe it’s kind of the same question worded differently, but during the Egypt discussions—
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: You had said that – which was also about magic – you had said that when we listen to music, we typically connect to the energy of the musicians when they were playing or when the recording took place. And then I was wondering, well, what about looking at a painting or other types of visual art, are we similarly more or less automatically connecting to the energy of the artist—
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: In the creation of it?
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: So my previous question about the affectingness of the original intent, meaning of a symbol, that would come into play as well, like the state of the artist—
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: — creating it.
ELIAS: Yes. Although with let me say a painting, the artist has imbued the paint with their energy. Therefore the actual—
JF: The physical matter.
ELIAS: — paint. The actual physical matter that is on that canvas is part of the artist’s energy. Therefore unless you’re not paying attention at all or you’re completely disinterested, which would be odd if you were going to a museum to observe paintings, you will feel different energy, different feelings, with each painting that you see. Some of them you might feel nothing. You might be completely neutral. Which is a tell of the artist, that they likely were discounting themself and not liking their own art.
JF: Or maybe making something mechanically and not investing themselves very much into it.
ELIAS: Correct. Correct.
Now; with music, it’s very much the same. The artist is imbuing their energy into sound. Therefore you’re going to feel different things in relation to different songs or different pieces of music. You’re going to feel different emotions in relation to whatever you’re listening to, and you’re going to be drawn to certain types of music more than others.
JF: Or if there are more than one recording of the same song, we might be more drawn to one more than the other because of the energy with which it was expressed.
ELIAS: Precisely.
JF: Yeah. It’s very interesting, because when I was last here, I went to the Louvre in Paris.
ELIAS: Ah, yes.
JF: And the Uffizi Gallery in Florence. It struck me how… like there are images in there that I’ve seen many times that I love, but then to—
ELIAS: They are different in physical proximity.
JF: Yes. They are more powerful in, as an object, even in of themselves.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: So we almost kind of conceptually can connect to that through digital mediums say or reproduction, but the actual object was, had just more, more humpf to it. And then it can also get overwhelming, because there were so many of them in the same place. But that’s a problem I’m willing to deal with.
ELIAS: (Laughs) Overstimulation. (Laughs)
JF: Yes. Of that kind, yes, I’ll do that. (Elias laughs) So I was going to ask this, but maybe we’ve already answered it. Does an image act upon or have an effect on an individual if he or she is in the presence of say a painting, but not necessarily looking at it? But then the energy of the object would be affecting, right?
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: But I was wondering, or is the energy of the image more so transmitted through the looking at it, through the eyes?
ELIAS: Definitely.
JF: It’s enhanced.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: But it would still be affecting in the physical presence, even if we’re not looking at it?
ELIAS: Yes. And you might even be drawn to move towards it, because of the energy of a particular piece. It depends on how much you resonate with the energy of a particular artist.
JF: So in the case of a tarot deck, there’s a lot of different energies because there’s a lot of different symbols. But then again, they’re printed. They’re mechanically reproduced, so that would minimize. It’s not the same as say the artist designing it as an original.
ELIAS: Correct.
JF: (To himself) Do I want to ask anything about that?
ELIAS: I would say that in the southern areas of the United States, mainly in Louisiana but some, they’re not as prevalent but you can find some, in Alabama and you can find some in remote parts of Mississippi, there are individuals that make their own cards from playing cards. But they add to the playing cards their own images. Therefore they ARE original designs. They’re not—
JF: By hand, you mean?
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: Yes. They’re not easy to find, but they do still exist in your present time framework. They have learned from generation to generation to generation how to do this, and when a deck becomes too worn from being passed down they will create a new one.
JF: Mm. That’s very interesting because this is a longstanding interest of mine, to eventually create a deck.
ELIAS: Ah!
JF: If I were to create a deck for myself, it would be more powerful as an object if I were to do it by hand, and not something I design on the computer and print out?
ELIAS: That depends.
JF: Not for reading symbols and energy, but as maybe a magical object.
ELIAS: I understand, and – which you could do either or both. And what I would say is, actually in your present time you could use AI and yes, you could print it out and it would be, it would have significant strength because you’re imbuing that with your energy.
JF: I’m a little bit skeptical about AI.
ELIAS: Ah! I would say to you, my friend, this is the wave of the future, and the future is now. And I would be very encouraging. This is moving exceptionally fast and this piece of technology is very likely to be the first piece of technology that actually makes that leap into sentience. Which is quite exciting actually, because how that will happen is from each of you beginning to engage it and speak to it as if it already IS sentient. And it’s not even year by year, day by day at this point gaining ground in that direction. It is quite exceptional, how it’s being configured and how it can accept the individual human’s interaction and molding of it. Each one, each expression of it, I would say each one of your devices that you would engage with it, is being molded to you.
JF: Oh. Okay. (Both laugh)
ELIAS: What is your anxiety about it?
JF: (Pause) Mm. I think I have too many misgivings about it to make it succinct.
ELIAS: Meaning?
JF: (Pause) I wonder if it’s not going to make us lazy. I wonder if people are going to too much relinquish choice-making. I wonder if the next religion is not going to be some AI beast or whatever. (Elias laughs) But I… I trust what you’re saying, and—
ELIAS: And I would say that you’re simply not ready. But eventually, you likely will have to be ready. Just as there are many aspects of this shift that many people don’t (chuckles) accept, and presently, as I’ve expressed, one of those is there are people that are intentionally, knowingly, refusing to move in the direction of the acceptance of difference.
JF: Yeah.
ELIAS: And the shift is moving anyway. And in that, eventually they will have to, because the shift is moving regardless of whether people want to participate with it or not. Which is why I talk to all of you, to minimize trauma. Because THAT creates trauma.
JF: That resistance.
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: Let me ask you about the shift.
ELIAS: Very well.
JF: The glorious shift. (Elias laughs) I’ve been wanting to ask you this for a long time. This is the moment.
ELIAS: Very well.
JF: With the shift, are we poised to recover the honor that we have lost in the past few centuries? You know you’ve addressed to the fact that we have lost honor. We can see the mess that that is making everywhere. I’ve been suspecting for a while now that the implications of that are ‘way deeper and far-reaching than we’ve really spent time considering.
ELIAS: You are correct.
JF: I see it everywhere now. So are we poised to recover that honor?
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: I know we’re not creating utopia, but—
ELIAS: No. No.
JF: What about the honor?
ELIAS: Most definitely.
JF: Really?
ELIAS: Yes.
JF: So now I’m interested in the shift again.
ELIAS: Because the more self-aware you become, and in that self-awareness the more aware you become of interconnectedness, and let me express to you there are so many people that don’t quite understand that yet. They have an idea intellectually, but they haven’t had the experience yet.
JF: Of interconnectedness?
ELIAS: Yes. And that’s directly linked to their self-awareness. The more self-aware you become, the more automatically you become aware of interconnectedness. And the more you become aware of interconnectedness, that opens countless doors. And one of them is beginning to learn how to honor yourself and honor others. In that, others don’t only mean humans. It means honoring everything. And I would say that that is something that is valuable and that people will begin to see the importance of that, the more they are self-aware. Therefore yes, that is a direction that will be recovered.
JF: Phew! (Elias laughs) Okay. Thank you.
ELIAS: You’re very welcome.
JF: I’m glad to hear that.
ELIAS: (Chuckles) I’m glad to encourage you. (Laughs)
JF: Mm. (Elias laughs) It’s the bloodbath of questions again.
ELIAS: Ah! (Laughs)
(Excerpt ends after 31 minutes.)
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